general dirt track questions

[burlap1980]

Tire prep what do you use? (Wintergreen, cresot, etc)
Is the dx3e controller worth the upgrade from the stock remote.

Aluminum parts worth the cost.

What's the best upgrade I could make.

[burlap1980]

Foam tires. For the tire prep question

[SpaceGhost]

Lucas Synthetic oil treatment. Leave on for no longer than 10-15 mins then wipe off.

For MLM the stock controller is just fine. Especially if you have to run stock ESC.

I personally think the Aluminum bulkheads and such is a waste. If they were that beneficial Losi would offer them.

Suggested upgrades:

Hitec Metal Gear Servo
Losi Aluminum Threaded Body Shocks
Losi Metal Diff Gears or Ball Diff
MIP CVD
Dual Disk Slipper
Metal Pinion
Steering Drag Link with Bushings.

[burlap1980]

Lucas Synthetic oil treatment. Leave on for no longer than 10-15 mins then wipe off.

For MLM the stock controller is just fine. Especially if you have to run stock ESC.

I personally think the Aluminum bulkheads and such is a waste. If they were that beneficial Losi would offer them.

Suggested upgrades:

Hitec Metal Gear Servo
Losi Aluminum Threaded Body Shocks
Losi Metal Diff Gears or Ball Diff
MIP CVD
Dual Disk Slipper
Metal Pinion
Steering Drag Link with Bushings.

Thanks man didn't wanna gum up your thread with my questions

[SpaceGhost]

Thanks man didn't wanna gum up your thread with my questions

No problem. If ya have any other questions, just let me know.

[burlap1980]

where do you get your parts from. i am having a hard time finding parts

[SpaceGhost]

where do you get your parts from. i am having a hard time finding parts

Typically I try not to promote online resellers but since my LHS charges 30% OVER Losi MSRP and is rude to anyone but his one and only friend, I buy all of my stuff from AmpDraw. They have had amazing customer service. Super fast delivery even being in San Diego and their prices are unbeatable. Ampdraw.com

[burlap1980]

Have you ever tried belt dressing on your tires. I was told that works well also. What spur gear is safe to use on the stock engine right now I'm using a 17 pinion gear and a 60 spur. I feel like I have to much tire spin off the line and no top speed. What's safe to use so I don't burn up my engine.

Also what and how and how often should I clean my engine

[SpaceGhost]

Have you ever tried belt dressing on your tires. I was told that works well also. What spur gear is safe to use on the stock engine right now I'm using a 17 pinion gear and a 60 spur. I feel like I have to much tire spin off the line and no top speed. What's safe to use so I don't burn up my engine.

Also what and how and how often should I clean my engine

Sorry about the long delay in response. Work has had me busy this past week.

I have never tried belt dressing before. I would get a old set of tires and try out on them first. With the stock slipper there are several spur options. But since I run the dual disk slipper, I can only run the 60T spur. And a 17 pinion! Yikes!! :eek: from the vid I saw of your track that is WAY too short of a gear! Taller gear! You are not getting topend speed because you don't have enough real estate to optimize the motor and that gearing setup. My track is almost identical to yours and with a brushed motor I will typically run a 13T steel pinion. With brushless I run a 9T.

As for cleaning my motors, I use Losi Nitrotec Spray Cleaner and love it! I used to use Aerosol brake cleaner, but it was leaving too much residue behind. The Nitrotec completely evaporates and leaves no residue. Also great for cleaning shocks during rebuilds and even getting grease out of the gearbox when doing rebuilds, upgrading, or simply changing gearbox lube. And a little of this stuff goes a long way. As for cleaning frequency. I clean all of my motors used after a night of racing. Probably not necccesary, but that allows me to check over things to see if anything needs to be replaced or fixed. Preventive maintence. I rarely have failures knocking me out of a race.

[burlap1980]

Hey man thanks for the reply. Just got my real truck running again so maybe I can get over to the hobby store and get some cleaner.

[SpaceGhost]

Hey man thanks for the reply. Just got my real truck running again so maybe I can get over to the hobby store and get some cleaner.

Anytime man. Hit me up whenever you have any questions and I will try my best to at least point you in the right direction. And congrats on getting your truck running. It can be a real pain without your own ride.

[jason14]

Just a quick question.. What brand of batteries are you guys using in the mini sprint.. we dont allow lipos and run 1600mAh NiMH. We have tried a few brands but they are very hit and miss. I got 2 new intellect ones.. one worked fine the other wont fully charge.. This has happen with a few other brands too.. Same with the batteries that come with the car.. some are great other not so great

[SpaceGhost]

Just a quick question.. What brand of batteries are you guys using in the mini sprint.. we dont allow lipos and run 1600mAh NiMH. We have tried a few brands but they are very hit and miss. I got 2 new intellect ones.. one worked fine the other wont fully charge.. This has happen with a few other brands too.. Same with the batteries that come with the car.. some are great other not so great

I mainly run LiPo's but when I go somewhere that only runs NiMH 1600's I use MaxAmps packs. Never had a single problem.

http://www.maxamps.com/MA-1600-6Cell-Flat.htm

[burlap1980]

Noticed some people were running a different size tire on the left rear. Why? Also saw some tuning silicone in there tires is there a certain kind to use.

[SpaceGhost]

Noticed some people were running a different size tire on the left rear. Why? Also saw some tuning silicone in there tires is there a certain kind to use.

Different size as in diameter or width? Diameter would be stagger. If you run a smaller left rear tire this COULD help the car turn, but what many people forget is that this is primarily used in a car with a locked rear end. Our cars have a diff in them so MOST, but not all of the stagger effect is negated. Silicone capping was a practiced used years ago on foam tires to get more bite out of them. Back in the day when we used to do that, we used a GE silicone and I have heard that it has since then been discontinued, but i am sure there are other options out there. I read a post about this on RCTech forums not too long ago. Again, with the improvements of foam rubber and traction compounds, I think the weight you would gain by capping your tires with silicone would be negligible.

[burlap1980]

Yes diameter. I figured it was to put more weight on the left rear. Hey do you know anyone that has done the associated rc18 swap for the front end. Which eliminates the bulk head issue. I have broken 3 now and its frustrating because the first was my fault slammed the wall but the last two have been a small tap and then break.

[SpaceGhost]

Yes diameter. I figured it was to put more weight on the left rear. Hey do you know anyone that has done the associated rc18 swap for the front end. Which eliminates the bulk head issue. I have broken 3 now and its frustrating because the first was my fault slammed the wall but the last two have been a small tap and then break.

I do not know anyone that has done a conversion of the sorts, nor have I ever heard of it to be honest with ya. Never have broken a bulkhead before either. But 3 times?!?! :eek: It's racing man! Not demolition derby! LOL j/k Well before I believe you had asked about going aluminum. Maybe give it a try. If what you have now isn't working, it's time to try something different. So before swapping out parts from another brand of car, I would try an aluminum replacement instead.

[burlap1980]

Yes sadly three lol. Idk what the deal is. I have tried something new this time reenfoced it a bit.
So let me pick your brain a bit I have my car pretty well set up but its still needs some work. I put a thin silicone cap on my tires and ran it made a difference but also reinforced what I was thinking what my car was doing.

It's tight going in and I would say semi loose outta the corner not bad but fish tales just slightly. I will try and post up my setup when I get home.

[SpaceGhost]

Yes sadly three lol. Idk what the deal is. I have tried something new this time reenfoced it a bit.
So let me pick your brain a bit I have my car pretty well set up but its still needs some work. I put a thin silicone cap on my tires and ran it made a difference but also reinforced what I was thinking what my car was doing.

It's tight going in and I would say semi loose outta the corner not bad but fish tales just slightly. I will try and post up my setup when I get home.

Tight going in and loose coming out, I would add more RF spring. That will help you turn in better and transfer weight to the LR coming out making the car tighter.

[burlap1980]

here is my set up let me know what you think

[SpaceGhost]

Way too light on the shock oils. 35 would be ok for Left side only, but you need closer to 70/80 on RF and 56/60 on RR. And 12 turns of preload sounds like WAY too much. Sounds like you need to step up to some stiffer springs if you are having to put that much preload into them. I suggest using the Losi Orange springs on the RF and LR for a good starting point. Maybe 2 turns down on the RF and 0 turns on the LR. I would also suggest for the size of track you are running try a 14T pinion and possibly a 12T. How are your motor temps? A 17T needs A LOT of track to fully utilize it. That is a big time speed gear.

[burlap1980]

Motor after about 20-25 laps is hot. Not ,so hot that I can't touch it but hot. 14t sounds different how much speed would that knock off. What's Ur thinking behind it? You think that I might be able to go more gas around the turns ? For some reason I was thinking you would want a soft spring on the LR. The reason its 35wt is because my LHS was outta the higher stuff waiting for it to come in. Also any ideas on how to stop the oil from leaking out?(tephlon tape)
Thanks for all your help man.

[SpaceGhost]

Well my thinking is that with the motor getting hot, you are not optimizing the motor and gearing. A hot motor is indicator that you are overgeared. Energy is used to create heat. So if you have heat you are wasting energy. And yes a 14T will allow you to drive deeper into the turn and get back on the throttle sooner coming off.

On dirt you almost ALWAYS was a stiffer spring on the LR. This is how you obtain crossweight percentages. The corner with the stiffer spring gets the weight. When coming off of a turn you want to drive outwards towards the wall (push). This allows you to accelerate off the corner without the fear of spinning out. If there were more weight on the RR it would want to turn left. More weight on the LR makes it want to turn right. That is why you are having a car tight in and loose off. Your setup is basically backwards. You want to be a touch loose going in (so it is easier to set the car) and a touch tight coming off so you can accelerate hard off the corner without spinning out. It is easier to let off the gas to keep from hitting the wall instead of getting a car squared back up that is spinning out.

[burlap1980]

Okay yeah that makes sense

[SpaceGhost]

Okay yeah that makes sense

Of course it does! LOL ;)

[burlap1980]

What about the other two springs. Got the orange on and the 14t pinion.

[SpaceGhost]

What about the other two springs. Got the orange on and the 14t pinion.

I run a Losi Pink on the LF and a Losi Red on the RR. You could use the stock black on the RR. Not sure what all springs you have to choose from.

This is exactly the springs I run:

RF: Losi Black
LF: Losi Pink
RR: Losi Red
LR: Losi Orange

[burlap1980]

I have the spring set red pink Orange. I have some other springs that came with the car they are a bit shorter but they are white and blue

[SpaceGhost]

I have the spring set red pink Orange. I have some other springs that came with the car they are a bit shorter but they are white and blue

Are the white and blue losi springs?

[burlap1980]

Yes I belive so.

[SpaceGhost]

The only springs I can find that are blue, made by losi, and made for the mini's are these: http://losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1119 But there is not a white spring in that set and the blue should be longer as those are for the rear of the mini t. So I am not quite sure what the spring rates on those would be, so I will do some more digging around.

[SpaceGhost]

Are you sure the white and blue springs aren't from the Associated set?

[burlap1980]

Yeah that's very possible. They are shorter than the losi springs I got Saturday. I don't have any of the stock springs. So Sunday I set it up like we had talked about it was a lot looser getting in the corner but also outta the corner. Which spring should I change out the assoc. One with. When I get home I will post up a set up sheet of my car I also have now put on a custom battery holder which comes out to the wheel base.

[SpaceGhost]

Yeah that's very possible. They are shorter than the losi springs I got Saturday. I don't have any of the stock springs. So Sunday I set it up like we had talked about it was a lot looser getting in the corner but also outta the corner. Which spring should I change out the assoc. One with. When I get home I will post up a set up sheet of my car I also have now put on a custom battery holder which comes out to the wheel base.

Once I see your setup sheet we will see what we need to correct a loose in and loose out situation.

[burlap1980]

new set-up 2/14/11
here it is. maybe you can give me a couple to try with what your thinking man if its loose in tight out or tight in tight out tight in loose out. you know something like that
thanks a ton man. BTW i think that 14 is going to be good im slower down the straight but if i can hang the corners i think i will have it

[SpaceGhost]

here is my set up let me know what you think

You are still running WAY too many turns on your springs.... WAY TOO many. At that point when you start compressing a spring 12 turns, you have the wrong spring.

With the springs you have... Run Orange on the RF and LR. And Red on LF and RR. With the shocks fully extended and the springs seated on the lower perch. Run the adjusting nut down to a SOFT touch to the top of the spring. Then throw that on the car. Run 2 Hole pistons on the Right sides and 3 Hole pistons on the Left side. You will be money with that setup.

[burlap1980]

If it said 12 turns my bad. It was suppose to say 2. Thanks for the help I will definately put the set up on it and give it a shot. Just to clarify run the adjusting nut down on all four till a soft touch.

[SpaceGhost]

Yeah... Run it down to a soft touch on all four.... Then tune from there...

If Loose in:

+Turns on LF (will make car loose off)
-Turns on RF (could cause body rub)
+Turns on RR (will make car loose off)

If Loose off:

-Turns RR
+Turns LR (This is what I use most to adjust a loose car coming off)
+Turns RF

[burlap1980]

Yeah... Run it down to a soft touch on all four.... Then tune from there...

If Loose in:

+Turns on LF (will make car loose off)
-Turns on RF (could cause body rub)
+Turns on RR (will make car loose off)

If Loose off:

-Turns RR
+Turns LR (This is what I use most to adjust a loose car coming off)
+Turns RF

Hey man great info you have been a ton of help
Thanks

[SpaceGhost]

No prob man. Hope it helps.

[burlap1980]

Lucas Synthetic oil treatment. Leave on for no longer than 10-15 mins then wipe off.

For MLM the stock controller is just fine. Especially if you have to run stock ESC.

I personally think the Aluminum bulkheads and such is a waste. If they were that beneficial Losi would offer them.

Suggested upgrades:

MIP CVD
Dual Disk Slipper
Steering Drag Link with Bushings.
hey man who makes these parts my LHS had some but then gave me crazy looks on some lol!

[SpaceGhost]

Here is the Losi Part Number for the MIP CVD (LOSB1248): http://losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1248

Dual Disk Slipper (LOSB1131):
http://losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1131

Your LHS should be able to get those no problem.

As for the steering drag link, is appears to be getting harder to find the bushing style, but these work just as good and I have used them with success as well: http://www.thetoyz.com/cart/thetoyz_details.lasso?id=9892&cat_name=MINI%20T%20&%20BAJA%20&%20SLIDER

Hope this helps.

[rcracer531]

dose shorting the shocks help any

[SpaceGhost]

dose shorting the shocks help any

I have been experimenting with this on the RR and LF. It does help with getting a lower initial ride height while maintaining a good spring preload. So it is beneficial in that regard, but it hasn't been a 'make or break' adjustment to any of my setups. The downside I have with it is the fact that I have to disassemble my shocks anytime I want to make an adjustment to the shock length.

[burlap1980]

How would spliters affect the down force. Anybody tried them

[SpaceGhost]

How would spliters affect the down force. Anybody tried them

I have never personally tried a splitter, but it would have effect it two ways. One would be the additional surface area for air, but more the case would be the added weight. I really doubt that it would be all that beneficial, but I could very well be wrong. Once I get my new molds I will put a splitter on a body and throw it in the wind tunnel and see what we get.

[riofebdinan12]

The downside I have with it is the fact that I have to disassemble my shocks anytime I want to make an adjustment to the shock length.

[SpaceGhost]

The downside I have with it is the fact that I have to disassemble my shocks anytime I want to make an adjustment to the shock length.

Troll.... Go back to underneath your bridge and tell riddles to people as they pass by.

[burlap1980]

I have never personally tried a splitter, but it would have effect it two ways. One would be the additional surface area for air, but more the case would be the added weight. I really doubt that it would be all that beneficial, but I could very well be wrong. Once I get my new molds I will put a splitter on a body and throw it in the wind tunnel and see what we get.

wind tunnel wow i am jealous.

[SpaceGhost]

wind tunnel wow i am jealous.

Super easy to make if you know what you are looking for and what data you want out of it. I will post some pics for you guys.

[Counting Crows]

SpaceGhost,

Who makes a 9T pinion gear? The smallest I can find is an 11T.

[SpaceGhost]

SpaceGhost,

Who makes a 9T pinion gear? The smallest I can find is an 11T.

Losi Makes a 9T Pinion. Comes in this set: LOSB1260 (http://losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1260)

[Counting Crows]

SpaceGhost,
There is alot of setup advice in this post...so here is a question I thought I would post. What changes occur to the handling when you change the rear pivot blocks. I saw for the mini sprint there are 0 degree and 3 degree. I race on a small flat hard packed clay oval. Thanks for the advice. Your videos are excellent.

[SpaceGhost]

SpaceGhost,
There is alot of setup advice in this post...so here is a question I thought I would post. What changes occur to the handling when you change the rear pivot blocks. I saw for the mini sprint there are 0 degree and 3 degree. I race on a small flat hard packed clay oval. Thanks for the advice. Your videos are excellent.

I haven't gotten around to trying the new pivot blocks, so I don't know if that 3 degrees is in tow or in caster. So I will describe the effects of both and once we find out what the direction they are in you will be able to determine if the blocks are correct for your setup.

So let's discuss rear Toe:


Less Rear Toe "IN"
Less straight-line stability
Less traction out of the corner
More steering
Higher top speed

Intermediate Rear Toe "IN"
Intermediate straight-line stability
Intermediate traction out of the corner
Intermediate steering
Intermediate top speed

More Rear Toe "IN"
More straight-line stability
More traction out of the corner
Less steering
Less top speed

Now let's talk about caster. Caster is the movement of the wheel forward or rearward under suspension compression. Rear wheel caster has a different effect than front wheel (steering caster). Front wheel caster wants to assist the wheels in straightening up. Rear wheel caster has a cool effect of causing rear wheel steer (in an effect). So with a +3° caster. When the car rolls over on the RR (compresses the shock) the wheel will move backward (lengthening the wheel base). So when rolling through the turn and over on to the RR the LR suspension drops, so the wheel moves forward (shortening the wheelbase). So with a longer RH side wheelbase and a shorter LH side wheelbase it now makes the car "bend" to the turn. This is especially helpful on flat, tight turned tracks.

Hopes this info didn't confuse the matter more.

[rc4less]

SpaceGhost,
There is alot of setup advice in this post...so here is a question I thought I would post. What changes occur to the handling when you change the rear pivot blocks. I saw for the mini sprint there are 0 degree and 3 degree. I race on a small flat hard packed clay oval. Thanks for the advice. Your videos are excellent.

Hey CC, what is the part number for those 0-degree rear toe blocks for the Mini Sprint?
thanks,
BT

[SpaceGhost]

Hey CC, what is the part number for those 0-degree rear toe blocks for the Mini Sprint?
thanks,
BT

.......

There are also Aluminum spindles - LOSB1881 (http://www.losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1881) and Front Carriers - LOSB1880 (http://www.losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1880), Rear Hubs - LOSB1882 (http://www.losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1882), and Zero Degree (LOSB1883) (http://www.losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1883) and Three Degree (LOSB1884) (http://www.losi.com/Products/Features.aspx?ProdId=LOSB1884) aluminum rear pivots, all as optional upgrades.

From another Thread.....

[SpaceGhost]

Hey CC, what is the part number for those 0-degree rear toe blocks for the Mini Sprint?
thanks,
BT

He BT! Why don't you sponsor me this? http://www.rc4less.com/product_info.php?cPath=46&products_id=430&osCsid=5f6efbb7fcc8c2eb8859ca95e75c16c9 HAHAHAHAHA! That thing makes me drool over and over!!!

[rclesmuny]

He BT! Why don't you sponsor me this? http://www.rc4less.com/product_info.php?cPath=46&products_id=430&osCsid=5f6efbb7fcc8c2eb8859ca95e75c16c9 HAHAHAHAHA! That thing makes me drool over and over!!!

Here's the same chassis but mid-motor variation, I likey.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140522132206&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

[SpaceGhost]

Here's the same chassis but mid-motor variation, I likey.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=140522132206&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

That's actually the same kit. And I believe the seller on ebay is actually the guy that makes the kit, but not 100% sure of that.

[Counting Crows]

Thanks for the pivot block explanation SpaceGhost. The kit from RC4Less is a CCS chassis with the mid motor conversion. I have the conventional rear motor version. I am getting it ready for the outdoor season. I'd be interested in seeing the different handling characteristics of each. I am really pleased with the quality and adjustability.

[nrtv20]

Such a good thread!!

So what is everyone’s opinion on the best dirt oval track size and shape?

I was thinking of making 2 different radii corners as to give it some character, any thoughts on the subject? Also it seems that the average drive line is between 150'-180'??

[nrtv20]

also what is a good brushed motor for the mini-slider that has long life but just as fast as the stock one?

AND... whats a good lipo that will fit in the mini-slider

Thanks!

[littlemel]

I have never personally tried a splitter, but it would have effect it two ways. One would be the additional surface area for air, but more the case would be the added weight. I really doubt that it would be all that beneficial, but I could very well be wrong. Once I get my new molds I will put a splitter on a body and throw it in the wind tunnel and see what we get.

Where do you get these splitters?